Hoarding in HOAs: Managing Cluttered Spaces and Diverse Personalities

Episode Blog

INTRO: This week’s episode of CACM chat HOA life to hear exclusive insights and expert perspectives on community association management from leaders across California. This podcast is about the hard work that managers do to positively impact the lives of more than 15 million residents living in over 50,000 homeowner associations across California.

ALIA: Thank you, thank you for joining us at the CACM HOA Life podcast where no topic is off limits. I am so excited to be here with Miss Becky Jolly. She is instrumental in our NorCal region with Miss Natasha. Plug for Natasha. I’m kind of jealous you get to work with her on a regular basis.

Becky Jolly is a highly skilled Senior Community Manager at Professional Association Services with over 20 years of experience in the realm of CIDs, which if you don’t know what that is, is Common Interest Development. She offers unparalleled expertise and insights, and she’s passionately dedicated to her education evident in her captivating presentation and industry seminars hosted by CAI and us, CACM. And her mission is always to elevate the standards of community management by inspiring her colleagues and fostering an enduring sense of community through their work.

I think that is just in a nutshell because I could keep going. I’ve heard so many great things about Becky Jolly and how she’s been instrumental on partnering with educational events and her speaking engagement is, you know, I think when you’re excited to mentor others or share what you’ve learned, it radiates through. So, it’s very prevalent. Everybody that I’ve ever heard your name is just rants and raves about you. So, thank you for being here and it’s nice to officially meet you.

BECKY: Nice to officially meet you too. I definitely am one for educating others and I don’t think there’s anyone that you’re not going to learn something from. So, you can learn from everybody, including your cat.

ALIA: Amen to that!

BECKY: They know how to lay perfect. Get the right amount of sun, the right amount of the “I don’t care about you” human moments. I mean, they’re perfect, right?

ALIA: Actually, I’ve never heard that analogy and I’m kind of here for it. I feel like all the Swift-I’m not a Taylor Swift fan, but you know how like Swifties love cats. So, I think they would run with that. So, I think that’s good.

BECKY: I think everybody except for those that are paralyzed with fear love cats because they just they have that attitude that we all need as a community manager of I don’t give a ***

ALIA: And that’s what’s going to say this podcast is no topic is off limits on purpose. We are here because my friend Becky here has some hoarding information to do’s and don’ts what she’s seen some stories and then we’ll just see where the conversation takes us. So, I know that you’ve had some situations. Can you tell me about them?

BECKY: So, the one that always brings straight to my mind is going to be one where I had a homeowner at a mobile home cooperative. She also was suffering from dementia. And during the afternoons, evenings, she did what is called sundowning. So, she was no longer who she normally is. She would revert back to, you know, like a two-year-old mentally. And that that speaks to hoarding as a whole.

Hoarding is not someone that just doesn’t give/ care about their community or their neighbors. They have a mental defect, whether that is severe depression, dementia, Alzheimer’s, any number of things, or just having hoarding tendencies. People grow up in these situations and these circumstances and they become hoarders. Not because everyone says, what’s my future, you know, role in life? Hoarding! Who wakes up and says that? Just like they don’t wake up and say they want to be an association manager.

ALIA:  Yeah, I didn’t wake up and want to be in the HOA world and it just happens.

BECKY: You didn’t wake up and want to be a Karen, but you know, life happens. Life hits you, life bumps you, and things happen. So, with the lady who was sundowning, she needed help. And it’s not in the Community Manager’s handbook. I can tell you, there’s no class on here’s how to deal with someone that’s a hoarder. They don’t have them because that goes into the realm of mental health and not all of us are counselors. Not all of us have the mental capacity to be social workers. There’s so many things that come from this and the idea that you have to somehow fit everything in the community manager’s box because you got to figure it out is really, really hard. And it’s okay if you can’t do it just because me or the community manager next to you has dealt with it and can deal with it doesn’t mean you have the capacity to do it.

Sometimes the best thing you can do is call the county because then somebody else who is a licensed trained professional can help you. Sometimes it’s referred to an attorney I’ve had. So, with her, unfortunately with her dementia, she ended up, we got ahold of her family because her neighbors knew the children. And they called the children. Children came and go, my God. And the place was so bad. The floor had rotted out in sections of this mobile home and there were rats all over the house. It was, it was a horrible living condition and situation for her. They basically gifted the, gifted the house back to the association. So, the association could have it disposed of. They had her pick out whatever treasures she could still have that weren’t, I mean, in my opinion, it’s all biohazard, but people have different levels of wanting to deal with it. She ended up in a retirement home where somebody could-

ALIA: That’s heartbreaking.

BECKY: Yeah, it’s heartbreaking, but it’s a good thing. Yeah. It’s sad that she had to give up her home that she had been in for 30 plus years. Absolutely terrible. It’s terrible that then they had to demolish because there was nothing to save there. It was completely demolished.

ALIA: Wow.

BECKY: But at the same time, she was in a better place where she isn’t going to have those. She’s not going to be wandering on the community at night where someone may not see her and get hit.

ALIA: Yeah.

BECKY: She’s not, you know, in a rat-infested place. On the other side, at another cooperative, I have, well, I had a board member, former board member, she became.

She would hoard out her house as well as her back patio area. And every year we’d have to send her a notice, clean up your back patio area. And every year she would get the back patio cleaned up, couldn’t say anything about the interior because that’s not our space. And because it didn’t, she was in a single family or well, single level, I should say, single level home, the weight didn’t have a problem.

Cause that’s one thing that you have to think about is if somebody’s in a condo, where there’s multiple units, they’re not designed to hold people’s stuff.

ALIA: Right, right.

BECKY: Floors can give way. Things can break. In any hoarding house, you’re going to find a lot of neglect. So, if an association is responsible for something, chances are it’s only going to get worse. And they’re going to be fire hazards. So, you can start with reaching out to the county if the person is not in a position to listen, because most people who are in that condition are not in a place where they’ll hear it.

If they can’t hear it, you have to do something, whether that’s calling the county, if you can contact, maybe you have their family member who’s identified as an emergency contact, maybe it’s time to reach out to the emergency contact. Hey, have you gone and checked on your mom, your dad, your aunt, your uncle, whomever? Have you checked on lately? Have you gone to their house?

Have you gotten into their house? I mean, you don’t want to embarrass them, and you have to walk that fine line. And if you’re calling someone other than the homeowner, check with the attorney first. And it may just be, it’s something where the attorney steps in because if they’re creating a health hazard, you got to get the attorney involved, which is going to be hard. And I know most association boards are like, more money. Yeah, but liability wise, you know, if the floor gives way because they have an obsession with collecting something that’s super heavy. Maybe they like bowling balls.

ALIA: Oh wow. I didn’t even think of that.

BECKY: Hoarding can be any kind of obsession.

ALIA: Yeah.

BECKY: I mean, those trash mounts when you, I don’t know if you’ve seen an episode of Hoarders.

ALIA: It’s terrifying, yes.

BECKY: I mean, I’ve seen some, they’ve taken out, you know, entire containers, like three or four containers worth of a small little place because it goes from top to bottom. And this goes into the topic of mental health, which we all deal with on some level. But then we also have to look at how we talk to people in general. And one of the things you and I were talking about is neurodivergent versus neurotypical. So neurotypical are people who communicate in what is considered common or typical behavior. Neurodivergent are the opposite of neurotypical.

So, the divergent is going to be anyone that has ADHD, autism, who’s had trauma. You have trauma, your brain re-thinks and everybody’s brain thinks differently. If someone is telling you, everyone needs to think this way, everything is painted in the same world of gray. There’s all shades of gray, but you only see the world in black and white. That’s not your place, find another location because you’re never going to fit in with them. You do see the world in black and white.

And while yes, there are some portions of it that can eventually be gray, if someone can’t understand you as a person seeing it in black and white, and they want to change who you are as a fundamental core value, that’s not the place for you. That’s the place you need to leave because they’re going to see things one way, you’re always going to see it another.

How you process things is not going to be the way they process things. For me, I know that when I’m trying to understand something, I’m asking questions, not because I want to be a jerk, although I am often thought that way at times. I want to get to the root cause. I also overshare and over explain because I think everybody should know everything from soup to nuts.

ALIA: Yeah. I actually, I can see that because if you’re asking a lot of questions, and somebody’s getting rubbed like the wrong way by it, I want to, I’m asking so I can understand it better. Cause I want to see the whole picture. Like if I only have like one puzzle piece, doesn’t fully connect. But when I see all of it, I’m like, that’s where all my creative ideas start flowing and I get excited. And, but that’s how my brain works. It doesn’t mean everybody else’s works that way.

BECKY: Exactly. And then other times people will look at someone and, I’ve had a similar situation as you. So I’m going to tell you, you know, all these different things, you know, I’m going to say, I need XYZ. I need to know what Jane Doe and John Doe did. You can explain it, but then there’s going to be a relation to Jane Doe and John Doe because people are going to go, wait, Jane Doe, John Doe. Hmm. Well, that’s similar to what I had happen at my life. And so rather than, you know, rather than connecting as in listening, that person is going well, Jane Doe and John Doe, that situation, I have the same situation. And then that person gets to that speaking point and they go, Hey, so Mary Sue and, you know, John over here, I had this situation.

They’re trying to explain and empathize with you by explaining how the two are connecting, but that’s not how everybody sees it.

ALIA: Yeah. I can see that.

BECKY: You see the connection points. Some people see all those connection points. Other people don’t see those connection points.

ALIA:  Some people pick up. I mean, this is me. I have to like protect my energy. Obviously, I’m a very social person. I’m a very extroverted, loud person, and I’m aware of that. But I also have a big, introverted side where I have to like go in, read my book quietly, rejuvenate. Like if I’m, you know, hosting an event, the next day I don’t really want to talk. Like I want to rejuvenate. And obviously that’s not everybody because I know people that can go host 10 events and they’re still like, let’s do more, you know? But I think understanding ourselves better. And I love that you said the neuro, you said neurodivergent and neurotypical, correct?

BECKY: Yes.

ALIA: Because everything I know is the corporate side, which is the Myers-Briggs, the Enneagram, not that we’re comparing this, let’s be real, but it’s just kind of the concept. I love the human design. If you want to be a little woo-woo, the human design is my favorite, but the goal is really to understand ourselves and understand others and give them grace.

And one thing you touched on, which you know, you probably didn’t even realize is as you’re describing these hoarder situations, I’m going backwards a little bit. I can tell there was compassion in a person to person versus shooting them an email, like handle this or, you know, county, take care of this. It sounds like you were really invested in supporting them. And I think that that’s a portion of a lot of what we do that people don’t even realize, you know?

BECKY: And that’s, that’s what happens.

ALIA: What are some tricks, for managers if they start running into one, we could go two ways with this, right? Like one, understanding themselves better and giving others grace by understanding other personalities. Cause that’s really what we’re doing is navigating personalities or, and two, what are some steps when it comes to hoarding that they can kind of follow?

BECKY: So, with hoarding, the easiest thing that I can say is reach out to legal, reach out to your senior manager because they, are they’re going to have the equipment. Now, if your senior manager doesn’t have it, they have the resources. They will figure it out. If you are a senior manager and you haven’t dealt with this, there’s other people in the industry. I myself, I have no problem helping somebody else. But don’t try to step into a line that you’re not comfortable walking. So, if you don’t feel confident that you can explain this to this person, deal with their mental health issues, then don’t go the legal route.

If you think you can have a conversation with this person, hey, you know what, we’re really concerned about your situation. This does affect others. Is there something, can we provide you with some resources? Whether it’s a quick little search that says, I’m going to, you know, social services. You can, you can Google them and give them a piece of paper that here’s the printout and email. Here’s the list, and that may be something for them to start. That doesn’t mean you’re going to have a lot of connection points because hoarding is a disease and it’s a disease that somebody lives with, just like alcoholism.

ALIA:  And that’s when there’s a fine line, right? Like handling it.

BECKY: It is.

ALIA: But I could see how if there’s rat infestation or pest infestation or something, you know, a stench or something where it gets worse and it’s now affecting their neighbors, I could see how you have to handle it right away because now it’s becoming a nuisance, even though it’s a totally different issue, it falls under that nuisance umbrella, right?

BECKY: And so that’s where you may want to get the attorney involved. You can report it to the county if you truly believe that there is, you know, a health and safety hazard. I mean, if they’re having a rat infestation, that’s a health and safety hazard in my opinion. Yeah. But when you look at it as far as a manager connecting with people, one of the things, you know, I know when I was taught in school, If their eyes are not on you, then they’re not paying attention to you. That’s false. Not everybody needs to look at you to engage with you. Sometimes people need to look at their favorite pin. Maybe they need to fidget while they’re because that’s what reminds and engages them. When people do repetitive tasks, I know that I will listen to the exact same song on repeat and people are like, my God, can you just shut this off? No, because it is going to get me through exactly what I need to do.

And it’s that calm level of noise for me that it may not be actual calm music. I can be listening to some crazy stuff. Usually, it’s music that I’ve stolen from a movie. But that gets me through my day. And when I’m trying to focus on people, I’m not necessarily looking at them. It’s not because I’m disrespecting them. It’s that I don’t engage looking at you.

I will look at you when I know it’s important to you, but it doesn’t always record everything in my brain. And sometimes I’ll look off to the left, off to the right.

ALIA:  You know, well, you’re thinking of what you’re saying too, right? Like if I’m in a lecture, I have a hard time sitting still. That’s why I love what I do because I can’t sit still, but I’ll be doodling. Like the, and what happens is it’s like, have notes on one side and like weird funky artwork on the other. And people probably don’t think I’m listening, but I’m absorbing it because I have to be.

It’s either that or shaking my pen or shaking my leg or, you know.

BECKY:  It’s your way of recording things.

ALIA:  Yep.

BECKY:  So, for me, I like to know exactly what I was doing. So, if I, for my brain, if I am listening to music while I’m typing away a letter, I know what I typed in the letter when I listened to that music.

ALIA: Yeah. And some people need silence.

BECKY: Right. Some people can do it in silence and my God, you’re amazing humans that you can live in silence. I don’t know that I can. But you have that playing in your background for me that puts a little note in my file and my filing cabinet in my brain that says, when I listen to Collegian’s, you know, drive fast, I’m literally going to go, yeah, that’s I was doing. This is where I’m going. And yay, I can keep going.

Versus stopping, pausing, taking a phone call and trying to handle that and you’re like, ooh, now I got to go back. What was I doing? Play the music and then I’ll know what I’m doing.

ALIA: Well, you know what, when you get interrupted, which I’ve just found out, when you get interrupted doing something, which I love the concept of an open-door policy because I think it’s important for people to collaborate on a regular basis. But if right now my door is closed, it’s the only time it’s been closed all day so that nobody interrupts us, I digress. What I meant to say was, It takes 15 minutes. If you get distracted by something, it takes 15 minutes to reboot what you’re doing. And if you’re ADD like me, it takes a little bit longer. So, you better stay organized. Like I have my list in front of me. This is what I have to get done. I have my extra list in the case I even get to that list. And that way it’s like, okay, this is done. Move on to the next thing. know, call that person, go on that drive, like whatever that thing is. So, but you know,

It really is, everybody is just, we don’t know where they come from. We don’t know their generational trauma. We don’t know what their childhood looked like. We don’t know what their regular conversations are looking like. That’s why all we see is an email and we want to remove it off our to-do list, right? And so we’re just getting it off our plates. But really we need that human to human connection so they understand like, look, I am actually here to help you. And that’s why I prefer to pick up the phone, especially if it’s going to be a rocky conversation.

I want them to hear my tone because my tone, if I email it, they might be like, ew, who is this person? But if I say it, they might be able to understand it a little bit better. We can dive in and uncover it together and solve the issue together.

BECKY: Absolutely. And that’s where I did find this really great little communication style. It’s a neurotypicals guide to communication style. So when a neurotypical person says, you’re rude or blunt. Neurodivergent is going to interpret it as honest, helpful, and informative. If you’re intense by the, you know, typical, the other side, you’re passionate, deeply informed. You’re weird. I love that. I love, I will always be weird.

ALIA:  I want to be weird.

BECKY: For the interpretation, it’s not understanding why certain social behaviors are important, lacking clarity on how to run a conversation smoothly. Not sure about private slash public topics. Good sense of humor, but certain jokes are tough. So, you’re weird. Aloof, that’s going to be a person that’s not sure how to connect. Afraid of being rejected, anxious, not interested in small talk or trivial topics. So, you’re bad at small talk. You’re aloof. Monopolizing conversations. Interpretation. deeply passionate and knowledgeable about a topic. Unable to figure out exactly how much detail to be shared for clarity, not info dumping.

Stating the obvious. Interpretation, looking for a connection, establishing common ground, having a conversation in an accessible way, and attempting small talk. You’re awkward. Aren’t we all awkward?

ALIA:  I’m super awkward.

BECKY: So, here’s the interpretation. Unable to decipher social rules of the moment, constantly worried about hurting someone’s feelings, second guessing everything, slow language processing. Missing subtle cues. If you’re too sensitive.

ALIA: I’m raising my hand on this one too.

BECKY: To emotional, hypervigilant and anxious due to frequent negative feedback and perfectionism.

ALIA: Ooh, that stung.

BECKY: Did that hurt a little?

ALIA:  That stung a little. That talked to me.

BECKY: Naive. Interpretation. Difficult understanding intentions, assuming honesty and good intentions, and thinking literally. So, if you say something, that’s how somebody interprets it. So, they’re naive. Distractive or inattentive. Here’s the thing for the interpretation, and I am guilty of this. Eye contact is uncomfortable and or overwhelming. Better attention without eye contact.

ALIA:  Interesting.

BECKY: So that’s where when you’re talking to someone, you have to look at the whole of a person, not the sum of their bits and bobs.

ALIA: I like that, say that one more time, for the people in the back.

BECKY: Stop looking at people’s bits and bobs. Look at the whole of the person.

ALIA: I love that.

BECKY: If you’re not sure at the end of the day, give somebody grace.

ALIA:  It’s true. It’s so true. And you know what? How many times do we get like an angry call or we’re, you know, here, I’m going use an example.

You’re working 16 hours in one day, you’re wrapping up your budgets, and somebody is calling you to scream at you for an hour about a wrought iron fence that you didn’t even know about. So, you’re put the work order in, it’s not an issue, I’ll take care of it, but I don’t know when they can come out. I’m going to call them and we’ll figure it out and I’ll follow up with you and let you know when that comes out, for an hour. I’m like, I wish that my problems were so miniscule that you could call me for an hour about a wrought iron fence.

It was just the little bottom too. It’s not like a pet could get out. It wasn’t like an issue, right? Like, but we’re going to take care of it. Don’t worry. So again, I digress at the end of the day. It’s like, I don’t know what’s going on in that person’s life. And I remember when I was out in the field, obviously I’m here now at CACM, but when I was out in the field, I would always tell myself a story. He had a rough day at work. He hasn’t eaten today because he’s been busy. His water heater just went out and it’s freezing cold.

I tell myself some dorky story, even if somebody cuts me off on the freeway. You know, they’re on the 405, it looks like they’re going to slam into somebody. Like, maybe they’re rushing to the hospital because it’s an emergency. I don’t know. But then I’m coming at it from a place of compassion versus anger, right? And I don’t know how healthy my response is, but I tend to like to make up stories in my head because I’m like, I want to give them love and grace and come at it more peacefully instead of, you know, combating it.

If somebody’s yelling at me, I’m not going to yell back at them on the phone. I’m going to remind them how I can help them; you know?

BECKY: Well, not everybody has that grace in the moment because I know I-

ALIA:  We’re human, we don’t all the time.

BECKY: so, I don’t want to cut anybody and go, well, you know, have to give grace all the time. You know what, sometimes you need the grace yourself too. That’s Sometimes, you know what, you’re having a tough day. You’re having a horrible thing that’s happened to you and you’re trying to just get through your day, and they are the last straw that has hit your back and you’re breaking.

And maybe you’re not in an environment that’s safe and comfortable for you to express everything that’s going on. Maybe you don’t trust the people you’re around for whatever reason, whether it’s not knowing them or knowing what they’ve done in the past that has somehow triggered, or maybe it’s a triggering event for you. So you don’t want to talk about it. That’s okay too.

ALIA: That kind of goes to giving yourself grace and giving yourself self-love and like avoiding burnout and figuring out your energy levels and protecting yourself. How do you do that for yourself when you’re in that kind of mode?

BECKY:  I’m working on it still.

ALIA: We all are, right?

BECKY: Yes. I don’t think I have that figured out because I would like to say that I always do the right thing. I don’t. When somebody re-hits a trigger. I will go to my defensive mechanisms because that is what has gotten me to this point where I’m alive. And I go into survival mode. And sometimes that’s all a person can be is in survival mode.

ALIA: Yeah.

BECKY: And that’s that whole-

ALIA: that you, well, let’s kind of like unpack this if you’re willing. What are things that in a perfect world, if you’re having a really rough day, what are like three things you can do for yourself that day that gives yourself love and grace?

BECKY: Find your work partner.

ALIA: Work wife.

BECKY: Yes, yes. Work wife, work husband, work human, work cat, whatever you’ve got. Find your work person and just snuggle up with them a little bit. Just have a moment. Hey, I’m about to lose my crap. I need to vent. I need to talk this through with you. And sometimes that’ll relieve enough of the pressure to get you through. When it comes to the second thing, step away.  We have brakes for a reason.

ALIA:  I was just going to say take your F-ing break people

BECKY: We need to take brakes. And brake does not mean sit at your desk, play on your phone. Like if you’re having that moment, just get out of your office, walk completely away from your computer. If you’re lucky enough to have an office pet, go find the office pet. If you have, you know, strays in the parking lot, go find the stray, whatever it is, whether it’s a cat, a duck, a dog, whatever.

ALIA: Go drive around the parking lot and do deep breathing.

BECKY: Exactly.

ALIA: Sometimes my breaks are like five minutes long. I just needed to do a alone time and then I’m good to go.

BECKY: I would say probably the third thing is remember that you’re human. You know, we forget that we get to have feelings about a situation too.

ALIA: Yeah.

BECKY: I mean, we’re there. I know for me, and my clients are very important to me and I never want them to feel like they’re being left out hanging out to dry. But we get to have human moments and go, my God. Yep, I’m with ya. I don’t necessarily like this person either. You’re not saying this to the client. You’re saying this to yourself or to your work wife. I don’t like this person either. I’m going to rise above because that’s all I can do today. And I would say fourth thing, chat GPT is your friend when you need to soften your email. So, if you are, hey, you stupid homeowner, I’ve told you this for 500 times.

Please park your car in your driveway. Stop parking in your neighbors, because I’m going to have it towed and I think you’re a horrible human. You want to type all those things? Don’t send it. Put it in chat GPT and say, please make this nice. And let the AI work its magic to reiterate on the positive things and take out all of your visceral feelings. And then it comes out sounding so nice like.

Please make sure you park your car in your driveway and not obstruct your neighbors. Have a wonderful evening. Goodbye.

ALIA: And definitely don’t put it in the email with their email contacts, because if you accidentally press the wrong button, it’ll hit send. So, you probably just do want to do it in a Word doc or chat GPT. That’s a good idea.

BECKY: Or send it to your work person.

ALIA: I didn’t mean to send that.

BECKY: Yeah, send it to your work person. Hey, I can’t stand this. Please, please help me. Here’s the thing, if you’re in a good supportive environment, they’re going to help you. There’s not a single person that’s going to go, I can’t help you. I can’t deal with you. It’s going to be, okay, give me five minutes or let me dive in and help you right now.

ALIA: Yeah, let’s do this together, because this is a together issue that we can solve together. It’s a partnership, it’s a friend, you know, it’s a team. We can’t do it just on our own. We’ll lose our mind.

BECKY:  No, and you have to find your team. Yeah. And it’s okay. If where you’re at right now isn’t your team, find your team and keep finding your team.

ALIA: You’ve been in the industry over 20 years. So, what are some, as we kind of close, what are some tips that you would give some newer managers in the industry, like under five years?

BECKY: Know that the day is going to be hard. This is not an easy job. Not that any job is really easy, except for maybe, you know, the ones that get to hand out the free samples of chocolate.

ALIA: At Costco, I’m down.

BECKY: I mean, those are, that’s some pretty cool, like, I don’t know, retirement goals, you know? You’re going to have hard days. And if you find yourself in a place that you don’t belong for whatever reason, you don’t fit with the culture, you don’t fit with the people, it doesn’t align with who you are as a human.

Stop trying to change who you are. Find someplace where you do fit because they’re out there. I’m not saying, you know, go bankrupt and, you know, ruin your life. Take the opportunity when you find the opportunity. Don’t be afraid to look outside of your group. You know, I know that when I’m done speaking engagements, I hand out my information. It’s not because I want to kidnap you, or I want to poach you. I work someplace. I am not a boss. You know, I’m just here to help. People are here to help you.

ALIA: There are some territories. I mean, I think some territories in California are, I mean, I’m looking at me and Natasha’s, you know, groups, right? That are so good about like partnering. It’s all these different companies and they collaborate all the time. And then there’s certain areas where like, I don’t want to go there because this company and this company are going to an event. I’m like, no, we want to, we’re under, we’re doing this together. We’re not trying to poach each other. That is wrong, but we can partner, and lock arms and I can share things that I’ve done. I mean, I’ve had some weird high-rise experiences. You’ve had some hoarding experiences we could totally share and like brainstorm together, right?

BECKY: Exactly. And that’s, that’s the other thing is that, know, don’t discount your own personal experience. It doesn’t matter if someone in your office has been there like myself for over 20 years in the industry and that’s industry wide doing all kinds of different jobs. This is not just being a community manager.

ALIA: Right.

BECKY:  They don’t have it all figured out. You may have something that’s really amazing that could shorten everybody else’s timeframe. Don’t be afraid to speak up. Just because you’re a newer manager doesn’t mean you don’t have valuable content to add because you have fresh perspective that some of us who have been doing this forever that are like,

ALIA:  It’s a new set of eyes on it.

BECKY: Exactly. We all survived the trenches. We survived them because we were willing to learn and adapt. So, the only way to learn and adapt is to listen to others. So may not, your approach may not work, and they may have a, here’s why it won’t work, but keep putting yourself out there. And don’t think that because you’ve been in the industry a short time that you don’t have something to contribute. You do. You have a lot more to contribute than you think you do. And don’t be afraid to get up and ask. Get up and speak.

ALIA: My big one is, I don’t care how long you’ve been in this industry, one minute, one year, 100 years, I don’t care. At the end of the day, put your ego aside and it’s okay to ask. I still ask questions. like, I know I should know this, but I’m going to ask because I want to make sure. So, it’s like, as long as we know where to go, who in the county to reach out to for hoarding, who to reach out to from a mental health standpoint to give that homeowner some resources if they ask. Who to contact if I have like some weird scenario and I need a specific niche vendor, who to like brainstorm with.

Like as long as you know who to go to, you could always have that answer. We’re not asking you to know everything right away. It takes time. And as long as you know where to go, where to look and how to understand people and give them compassion, you’ll do great.

BECKY: The other thing, give others compassion and give yourself compassion. Cause that’s what Grace says. So don’t lock yourself into a little hole and go, I should know this, I went to class, I should remember this. I can’t ask for anything. People are going to think I’m stupid. Nobody thinks you’re stupid. I know that I often will go to some, I’m pretty sure I’m stupid because you’ve told me this. I don’t know. I’m blanking. Like, yeah, I told you that once like five months ago. This is not a process you do every day.

ALIA: Some people need to hear it seven times before it clicks in. Sometimes more. Yes, depending on where your brains at you know.

BECKY: Exactly. And nobody has the corner on truth, and nobody has the corner on, you know, expertise. Even those that are experts can learn something new. And also ask your vendors. Yeah. If your vendor is doing concrete work, don’t be afraid to ask them questions. Why are you pouring the concrete this way? You say it’s bad and rain, but yet you’re doing it in light sprinkles. Why? You know, you can ask those questions and get that information and good vendors will always share all the knowledge.

ALIA: They’ll be excited to share with you for sure. They want to teach you. They want you to learn. They want to know that they were able to mentor you. Like that excites them.

BECKY: Yeah. So that’s the whole thing. You have to just get out there and have that conversation.

ALIA:  Yeah.

BECKY: And nobody’s going to tell you no, except for yourself.

ALIA:  Yeah.

BECKY: because you’re the one that’s saying you can only go so far. I like that.

ALIA: And on that note,

BECKY: on that note, now I’ll let you free.

ALIA: Actually, we brought up rats earlier and I have to tell you something I was thinking. One of my vendors, was a mouse in my backyard. This was years ago.

BECKY: Yeah.

ALIA: And I was like, it’s because I know where we live, there’s like a big, huge, open walking, hiking trail. probably got in there and I can’t get rid of it, and I have dogs back there so I can’t put poison back there. So, they said, if you put, now I’m a little bit of a clean freak, so bear with me. But if you put, actually Lori told me this in our office too, and I forgot about it. And I was like, yeah, that’s a good idea. Dryer sheets. If you put them in your like couch cushions outside, like let’s say you have back patio furniture and you like stick them inside there and then put them underneath, like they don’t like that smell so they will leave.

That thing was gone. So, I was stoked to share that. think anything that creepy and crawly, I don’t want anything to do with. So, I don’t want them in my backyard, but it’s, mean, there’s Back Bay. I live like in Costa Mesa, but Back Bay is like right there. And it’s like a big hiking trail. So I could, you know, it’s wildlife. It’s a huge wildlife area. So anyway, dryer sheets helps if you, as long as you’re not hoarding and there’s not an infestation, it’ll probably help you.

BECKY: Yeah. There’s, there’s definitely ways to combat pests, dryer sheets is one. You can get sprays. yeah, the peppermint spray, right? There’s peppermint sprays, there’s a lot of them, but I’m not going to advise those.

ALIA: Okay.

BECKY:  I would say go to your pest control expert for your specific location as to what’s working.

ALIA: Okay.

BECKY: And just remember that if you put out rat bait or anything else, you’re killing animals down the stream because the birds eat the rats. You know, birds die, you know, the things that eat the birds, then they die. And especially if you’re in your wildlife, just be cognizant of that.

ALIA: Yeah, for sure. There’s coyotes and I’m sure there’s all kinds. I know there’s coyotes and rabbits behind me all the time, but it’s the other ones. It’s the creepy, crawly ones. I’m like, no, go away.

BECKY: They’re there for a purpose.

ALIA: I know my brother always he always like he’s the type that would take the spider and put them put him outside. I’m like, no. We need to burn this place down. So, thank you so much for being here. I hope you have the best day. Thank you for your tips and tricks. And we went from hoarding to understanding people better to giving yourself grace. And I think these are all really good tricks. And I hope that if you guys liked this, you guys can let me know. And if you want more information about certain things, please share them with us.

Becky, where can they find you?

BECKY: They can find me at Professional Association Services. My email address is really, really difficult. It’s just becky@EAS-inc.com.

ALIA: Thank you so much for tuning in to CACM’s podcast. I am very excited that you were able to tune in.

I also want to just remind you that the topics that you guys share with us, we read them, we look at them, we brainstorm who we can partner with on those. If you have ideas on who might be a good speaker on the management side, we’d love to hear from you too. So don’t forget to email us at podcast@cacm.org and we’ll see you soon.

OUTRO: And that concludes this week’s episode of CACM Chat HOA Life. Have questions you want answered? Send them to podcast@cacm.org and we’ll address them in an upcoming episode. Make sure to regularly check out our website at cacm.org. And don’t forget to join our rapidly expanding social media community. Just follow at CACMchat on LinkedIn, Facebook, Instagram, and X. Thanks for joining me.